Lived Experience Forum

[CheerBear]

So much easier said than done to dispose of guilt @Owlunar, but I agree in that it isn't helpful. I feel frustrated with the amount of blame and guilt that can be heaped on mums in particular. The social world is so wonky and unbalanced sometimes.

As far as letting go of guilt, it helps me to be around others who 'get' it and who share openly, like many here give and do ❤

👋😘 @Faith-and-Hope. Tough stuff for you right now. Sending big ❤ to you and yours

[Owlunar]

Hi again @eth 

I think it is unsettling to mention some of the challenges of our past - we can trigger ourselves is not already triggered by someone else - I guess this happens and avoidance isn't the answer

I'm sorry you were stirred up after the Tuesday Topic too - and it seems we have both recovered - I think I have learned something - it seems that my son's circumstances is something I have to mention - maybe I need to pick my audience

However the subject was the challenges of parenting so I think my mentioning that having a child die certainly changes life as a parent - and if there are other children they are affected as well

And this is my story - so I need to share it - I am so much better than I used to be

Back to my marriage - there was very little DV - though I did yell a lot from frustration. The police were involved with the first time and the second time I made my ex-h leave and started life successfully alone - my previous efforts prepared me for the final break - I have never regretted it

And I discussed this with my daughter recently - had she been upset by our divorce? She told me she had already left home and was 18 when we were divorced and that's true. The reality is that when they are young our marital problems are not appropriate conversation with our children - after they are of legal age it's not any of their business.

Staying for the children in our case was okay - I don't think there was anything wrong with my mothering although I was stretched thin and insisted on my own life which I am glad about now

Your husband kissing you after your daughter's wedding would be strange - yeah - I get that

I think your daughter is very lucky to have you for a mother - it was so unfortunate that there was a doctor's accident that caused such a bad start for her. My daughter is a miracle as I'd been told I was unlikely to have a baby - and here we are

We have different lives but also a lot in common

Dec

[Owlunar]

Hi again @CheerBear 

Guilt is hard to dispose of but I had a huge lesson about it when my son died

Because he died in Juvenile Detention I was racked with guilt - but I was lucky that the chaplains at the university where I was a student knew me and I saw one of them after this - he told me that the people who felt the most guilt often had the least reason and those that didn't care perhaps needed to feel some

But they might have and not said so - who would know the truth

However my son was a State Ward by then and he had made bad choices and I had done my best to educate him and even though that didn't work I visited him two or three times a week when I was in Juvey - now I easily see the was angry at the world and found it hard to take the inevitable consequences - 

It's impossible to get over the guilt instantly - even decades lates I can still have twinges but that's useless.

And you are right - as mothers we are in the way of everyone's opinions and it's wonderful how many people feel they have the right to deliver their ideas and we can't possibly please everyone - it's hard work being single-minded but I am happier now because that was my choice

Let's hope women - especially those here - can get over unreal guilt. Life is better without it

Dec

[Owlunar]

Hi @Faith-and-Hope 

Somewhere around the forum I think I found out that you have finally separated - that must have been a hard decision for you - I know you worked very hard to make things work though your Mr's ED and superior opinions - I often wondered how you managed that

I'm not sure where your baby dragons are in all of this - I think you are on your own - actually they are all adults now I think so where they live is pretty much up to them. I hope this works out for you and you are feeling at peace with the situation

When gaming is mentioned here I think it's probably the playing of video games and not gambling - I play computer games but then my time is mostly my own and it's something I enjoy and don't feel it's out of control - it's different with young people though - esp when they have study and work commitments. I'm not at all sure how I would deal with it if I had youngsters around now - and I have to look up oppositional defiance - I think I have had a child with that trait - but I have to look

Oh yes - only it's not just a trait but a disorder! - ooh - yes - a lot of that fits my first child - but I thought that was having a mind of his own - and we all have that - I learn something everyday

You seem to have a good handle on being a quiet and firm leader with your kids. They can resist restraints - even my joy of a second child was a challenge in her middle to late teens - but she grew out of it - and still has her own mind which is respected by me because I like to have my own mind

Don't we all

I have a stressful change of specialists coming up - my previous pain specialist was not at all interested in talking about pain, quality of life, mobilty or whatever helped me in the past and was only interested in reducing medication sharply - I think I was politely but assertively oppositionally definant myself - my GP is supportive and I am seeing the new specialist next week - it has been quite something organising this

All the best Faith - your life is certainly interesting and challenging - I am glad you get caffeinated though

Dec

[utopia]

Thank you @Owlunar . Thank you @CheerBear .

Guilt is an awful emotion.  I don't think it serves much purpose. 

[eth]

Hi @utopia   You've done the hard yards with your son.  He's a young adult now, old enough to be more independent of you.  I've been where you are and I support you for not feeling guilty. 

My now adult child took off to their boyfriend's home at the same age (which had challenges of its own) but it was definitely for the better for both of us.  Conflict and aggressive/abusive/violent outbursts from them was just too much for me ( the extreme stress pushed me into mania - I have bipolar 1).  Police were involved several times and at one stage I couldn't even stay at our flat.  I let them have it for the last 3 months of grade 12.  I had to protect myself, and as they are legally blind (and many other reasons), I didn't want to kick them out so it was me that went for a while.  I ended up having to go to court and get a non-violence order (valid for a year) to be able to return to my home (after they finished school).  They were only allowed to stay on the agreement that they stuck to behaviour order.  If they breeched the order they would have had a criminal record for life.  We lasted out that year, with incredible strain in our relationship but at least no more violence.  The day after the order expired they lashed out again and left home, never to return.  However they did marry the boyfriend and have had a solid relationship now for over 12 years.  And we have done a lot of work about shame, guilt and forgiveness from both sides and are now friends again.

I wish I could offer some advice @Sweet_cheeks  but as you can see from above the only thing I was able to do with my child as they became a young adult was get out of the home temporarily and keep holding space for them once they'd left home.  There was no way they were going to accept advice, or even encouragement from me.  

Hi @Faith-and-Hope @CheerBear @Owlunar 

I think we're all awesome and absolutely do our best in every situation.  A lot of my guilt has been about the years where I was undiagnosed bipolar and a very different person from who I am now that I'm more stable.   And don't even start me on all the ways society judges mothers!  

[CheerBear]

So much in the way of massive challenges during your journeys @eth and @Owlunar. Awesome to be given some insight into what you've faced now you're through it. Thanks for sharing ❤

[Teej]

Hi 👋 @Sweet_cheeks, @Faith-and-Hope , @CheerBear , @eth , @utopia , @Owlunar , and all. 

@Sweet_cheeks Ive got four boys from 19 - 24.  It seems like your son is doing a lot that is good and healthy for him. Exercise, work, friends through gaming and in real life. 

Having said that I know this is about your guilt of him not reaching the potential that is possible. I’ve lived through that guilt with lots of mine. I’ve also lived through the gaming stuff where holes were punched in walls.....because of the game not me stopping them. It was a tricky time for two of mine when they were aged 18 and 19. They have both grown out of the emotional dysregulation of dealing with huge feelings around gaming. One still games but much less and one gave it up as he found other things in his life. I’m a believer that gaming can teach lots of life skills and transferable skills in life. I have to say I didn’t have the insight around helping them to regulate their emotions at the time because I was quite unwell and had no emotion regulation myself. I did however research gaming and found the good side to it and the balance of making sure other activities were included. It sounds like your boy has them. It sounds like he is bright enough to work it all out but it might take a while. It’s taken my eldest son a long a twisty path to get to be the man he is today. He had to find it though. 

@Sweet_cheeks @utopia (utopia I know I always try to find the silver lining for you and your son but I really believe you’ll find the sweet spot for you both). 

As history has it one of my sons ran away from home at 16 and never returned to live with me. He was pretty much abandoned by me when I was unwell and not coping. He wasn’t coping either but I couldn’t see it. Long story short 6 years later he is still living in his friends house. Much of his crucial development came from the family that took him in and accepted him for who he was. 

Once I was well enough I saw him a few times and we went out for tea. He was 17. I apologised for all the shitty things I’d done and for not being there when he needed me the most. I also told him lots about the beautiful human being he was and reminded me of his strengths. Much of these talks were  when he visited me in hospital or respite. It was a really good chance for us to start our new relationship. I had to suck eggs on some things that I struggled with because he had to find his own way.....and because it was counter productive to our relationship. 

@utopia The truth is he and I would have struggled lots in those years from 16-22 if we’d lived together. I think in hindsight we both dodged a bullet. When I moved both times I offered a bed in my house but he told me he couldn’t live with me again. It was partly a relief too because I don’t know how I would have gone. @Sweet_cheeks There would have been many more holes in my walls but not from gaming 😳. 

From my experience the relationships are the biggest part. Keeping them functional and with room to grow is so important. My relationship with the one I haven’t lived with for years is really good now. He rings me every week and tries to see me once a week. I still work at keeping it going cooking his fave foods and letting him know how proud I am of him constantly. I don’t think it would be this good if we’d lived together through those tricky years when I was so unwell. I love his company and he always makes me smile. He doesn’t have a permanent job and possibly never will but he has never gone a week without a job. He is fiercely independent and yet still gives time to me and his brothers. He has a gorgeous soul. When things were really tough all I good see was what the bad stuff was (and there was plenty of school suspensions and more). Working on the relationship just using positives and encouragement helped heaps. I got to bury my head in the sand for some of those hiccups and bumps in the road because I couldn’t see it when I wasn’t living with it. 

Sorry for the thesis :face_with_rolling_eyes:. I just wanted to share some of my experiences with adolescent boys. I have walked different paths with all of them but I have apologised so much for when I let them down when I was out of control. I think it helps for them to see you are genuinely sorry. I think we can’t live in that space though. After the apology I think repairing relationships has helped me. 

[Faith-and-Hope]

Separating decision was made for me @Owlunar .... after all that, WH is moving on with someone else.  In a lot of ways that has finished things rather decisively.

[Shaz51]

ohhh thinking of you lots today @Sweet_cheeks 

it is hard and when it is my step D! birthday  and betwenn her real mum and me and her mother inlaw too be

was too much for my mr shaz

@CheerBear, @Faith-and-Hope , @Teej , @eth