Lived Experience Forum

[Ricardorider]

As  aguy in my lat 50's i have seen my fill of alpha males. 20yrs ago i was one! Things for changed, my mates didnt.

One of my good mates ended up in hospital last week, blood clost on the lungs and one in his leg. No not covid vax. but one of the few who got them and the docs cant tell him why.

So he saty in ICU for 2 days but the next 5days were on the wards. Didnt want to tell anyone excpet his partner. (whom I dont like) 

So i call him end of lat week how ya going. i get the potted history thru gritted teeth of wahat happened. I asked so why you not tell anyone Got your story in the papers for big money. "No, i was just crook"

Says to me he wanst to go home just waiting on the docs to give him the thumbs up. ok I ge that talking about himself isn ths strongest point in the 30yrs i have known him. He gives me the I'll call you next week and hangs up

Stupidly I rang Saturday and asked hey you at home? Breif answer and the ubiquitous call you in the week line. ffs

I get the alhpa male thing really I do a mate is down and you follow up. The RU OK campaign directed squarley at men fails time and time again

Point: I give up calling  a guy who is either s**t scared to answer of annoyed i rang not sure which probably both.

HE aint no hero he will loose his job in 2 months  This has caused massive sttress, weoight loss lack of diet and sleep. Not so indestructible.

As for me I have my oewn battles to fight roight now health and lack of  ajob over heated labour market to few jobs and an a shedload of applicants and emlolyers who are spoilt for choice with applicants

Not sure if there are any alphas on here or not but if a mate reaches out FFS dont knock it back. I have been there done that and tbh I wont be calling my 'mate' back am too busy with myself to be worrying about someone who can only give me 45sec answers. Why bother, becos i should or is my own health not important..

Your thoughts anyone??

[AussieRecharger]

@Ricardorider 

First things first, Good on ya for reaching out. If you reach out and a bloke does not want to shake your hand, it is a choice he has made and it could just be the day / time place etc. 

Hospitals are not the greatest places and in my stays in them, I would want to be to have a deep and meaningful. I hear you, you're a good mate who wants to be in his corner but he has a misso and she's probably in his ear enough for the 2 of you.  If you really want to hear his story, do an alpha male thing, go fishin, campin, or get him over to help you build Ikea furniture.  Blokes don't do well talking without something in their hand, be it a beer or a tool. 

Also, for your own mental health, don't take it personally mate, if he wants to talk to you in a week, he still values you as a mate but his brain is probably on steroids at the moment thinking about family, bills and all the other stuff that hospital is stopping him from looking after. 

The next time you call him, have a good joke on hand, and if the bloke laughs at the joke, you know you just made his day better and follow on from that. 

[Appleblossom]

@AussieRecharger 

Love your line blokes dont do well talking without something in their hand ... beer or tool ...

@Ricardorider Sorry about your mate, and sorry about the difficulties of reaching out over all that cultural conditioning.  We all have to be careful with our energies and too many brusque rebuffs dont invite another .... 

I thought it was an important post generally, cos of all the toxic talk  yadayada ... we all love an alpha when he is up ... its in the movies ...  I am female, but prefer male conversations, and love my dad, son and brothers.  Never felt comfie in typical female groups.

Take Care

Apple

Take care of you 

[Former-Member]

Good on you for just being there for your mate.True friends stick with you in the bad times as well.

as the others have said probably alot on his mind.I know i didnt even want to talk to my partner when i was in hospital they are the most depressing places.My girl actually smuggled my pup in to see me which brightened my day and the pups,was all good till the nurse arrived but she was cool just made us take her outside.

Mate look after yourself and i hope that you have someone to reach out to you as you have done for your mate.

keep your chin up a things will work themselves out 

[KAn1]

Yeah mate, stoicism doesn't help if you don't have the confidence to back it up. 🙂 Agree

[chibam]

TBH, @Ricardorider  I can sort of understand your friend's point of view. Can you make his medical pain/discomfort go away? Can you set him up with a new, good job to replace the one he's about to lose?

If not, then from his point of view, is there any benefit whatsoever spreading his miseries out into the broader community, like yet another virus?

I've never seen the point of inflicting personal miseries on to other people if you can't reasonably presume that doing so will create a route to a solution to that problem. I might open up to someone about by unbearable loneliness if I believe they have the contacts and inclination to set me up with a single girl who would be an ideal match for me. But if they don't, then what's the sense in making someone else miserable by inflicting my own miseries upon them? Seems very petty and immoral, IMHO.

And it's a philosophy that's backed up by personal experiance. I know how unpleasant it is to be stuck in a room with someone bemoaning their own woes fruitlessly (i.e. they can't reasonably expect that inflicting that misery upon the room will lead to a remedy for that misery. Nobody within the room has the direct nor indirect power to solve their problems). Those are situations I would prefer not to have to suffer. So I cannot ethically be expected to treat people in a way that I myself loathe being treated.

I think, if we hope to live in a world with no misery (or at least, minimal misery), we all have a duty to minimise our own senseless dispersal of misery upon the community. So maybe your friend just doesn't want to put any more misery out there in the world.

[Ricardorider]

Thanks Aaussie recharger

Am fighting my own battles with health and lack of a job. Like psuhing a huge rock up a big hill trying to get back into work So am over sensitive to a lot of my own crap.

I hear what your saying 

But it cuts deep and I havent taken it well.

The RU OK thing works but as you said only if you are receptive clearly I didnt pick up the signs

TBh left me flat as a tack, as another guy i consider a mate basically said the same thing to me today. Am I acting like an old woman? i dont think so but the rejection i coped today set me back

Makes me wonder i have their backs did they have mine??. I have a chronic illness (crohns disease am off the grog, my medication) neither of them have taken any notice of what i'm going thru in 20yrs. They have their lives and I have mine  so it seems. No shite this will keep me up tonight and i wont get to sleep easily. YES am over sensitive... stuff me  I died 5 times in hospital I have PTSd anxiety and depression.

I now i reckon am on the outer with these two who i considered good mates

So do i have anything in common with these two any more, got to say it makes me wonder

[Ricardorider]

Hi Apple

i have known these two for a long time

Thought I was being  a good mate and reaching out to one who could have died with blood clots on lungs. Stuff me he was in hospital for 7days and I called to say gday and found out he was in hsopital. My call was about as welocome as apoke in the eye with a burnt stick.

What Aussie recharger says makes sense This guy has a partner and right now has a lot on. What gets me is the lack of thanks for calling.. appreciated it. Saying ok call you later & no callback

ok go with the stiff upper lip and the stoicism. Our Dad died at the ripe old age of 85 he was stoic to the last breath

Am not perfect I have a few major things popping off in my life but got to say I will think twice about reaching out again. yep it cuts deep from my side of the street

This alpha crap is toxic all right

Thanks for your reply Apple

I do my best taking care of me clearly i have to man up maybe foind new mates??

[wellwellwellnez]

I really want to share something about "alpha males". I only recently found this out but the original wolf research guy, David Mech, went back and had a look at what he called the alpha male wolf. After getting to know pack society better he changed his mind and reckons the big wolf wasn't trying to be a boss so much as good dad to the younger wolves.

Big male chimps (our closer cousins), unfortunately, are much more likely to go mad with power (and the other chimps encourage it. It's a mess). But male bonobo chimps (our even closer cousins (not proven but they walk more upright and are more tool savvy) are all sweethearts (most of the time).

So, "what's an alpha male" is kind of in flux right now. Some people are sayin' maybe it's less about strength and more about trust.

[Ricardorider]

So 2yrs on from my original post

Whats changed i have a job one i got myself no help from job active/DES

The alphamale oi spoke has lost his job

i reached out again and again met with silence. Rang his brother i did get a reply but again why did I bother

Move forward to last week rang to ask how ya going/ silence

Spoke to a mate who has become an acquaintance

Was told very nicely that our joint aquaintance  (alphamale) doesnt want to talk to me.

I have 12yrs in Recruitment he was a mate I can help out

Driving home tonight (am no longer in recruitment) i thought am just not going to bother again

The alphamale will end up on jobseeker i could help there too but why bother

I have my own life to get on with

My pyschol said as hard as it is knowing when to walk away is best

Mid life crisis is all its cracked up to be. i had mine 20yrs ago

Am still fighting it each day but am winning  A lot of hard work too